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craigppls
2116 Posts |
 Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:08:13 AM
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Factory orders number shows a nice gain. Inventories still shrinking and the factory orders number isn't all autos.
Inventory rebuilding will have to start sometime, will help economy. |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:14:37 AM
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.9%?
how much % did factories grew in china? |
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craigppls
2116 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:18:23 AM
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China...lol
some people here crack me up... |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:20:40 AM
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| I challenge you to do the numbers. Let em know what you come up with in China |
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craigppls
2116 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:27:59 AM
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Quit worrying about china... We fix our **** and we will be fine.
Their numbers have one advantage we don't have... They have billion people that were never really a part of their economy... Then poof they are buying... Good for them...
Capitalism... Is a good thing... or is it only good if we have it... |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 07:44:03 AM
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Our corrupted politicans are making china RICH.. Don't you get it? How in the hell are we're going to fix ourselves? Look at katrina aftermath, well?
No, we are NOT fine. Americans rather tuned on some American Idiot show than fixing our problems. |
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:28:10 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by craigppls
Factory orders number shows a nice gain. Inventories still shrinking and the factory orders number isn't all autos.
Inventory rebuilding will have to start sometime, will help economy.
Do you have any clue at all... even just a little one? The Sept number is up, by the same amount August was down and the very few up months in the past year were very insignificant compared to the huge down months. Shrinking inventories also are not good when manufacturing is not increasing. |
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craigppls
2116 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:34:45 AM
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Aug down .8 sept up .9 or aug/sept up .1... True
Inventories will come back... They have too at some point..
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:44:36 AM
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Retail stores are closing up this coming Jan 2010 so they have order less inventory than last year. Long Beach port said that truck drivers have less loads to haul than ever! I know few truck drivers who told me that they aren't getting much hauls and it's hurting them bad!
.9% is some improvements however our economy is sinking worse than ever! People may be hitting the malls but they are not buying as MUCH as they used to. Why are restaurants cutting back on their menu prices? So now you know |
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homer5
2252 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:46:45 AM
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Inventories should come back when demand comes back. Which is a long way off with a dead consumer. If they come back before demand does, that will likely be very, very bad news for manufacturers and the economy.
Representing only 12% of GDP, manufacturing will not lead this country out of recession. Rather it will go for the ride. As I said elsewhere, it's a rather insignificant development. |
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benjamin
6966 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:53:44 AM
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Forget about it Craig.
Govt. bullshiit. |
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homer5
2252 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:54:26 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by craigppls
Aug down .8 sept up .9 or aug/sept up .1... True
Inventories will come back... They have too at some point..
There is the real kicker and yet another example of the gov't deceiving.
.8% down was a revision from .7% up which is a .9% negative swing. Then September comes in at +.9% so in essence, we didn't go anywhere and we just shifted numbers to make things appear better than they are. |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 08:55:39 AM
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Goldman Sachs Predicts 9.4% Growth for China's Economy in 2009
Submitted by BOCVIP on Tue, 11/03/2009 - 10:56. English Daily Updates
U.S. Investment Bank Goldman Sachs says China will replace the United States as the world's largest economy in 2027.
By staff reporter Liu Zhijie
(BOCVIP.COM) China's gross domestic product is forecast to grow 9.4 percent in 2009 and 11.9 percent in 2010, Goldman Sachs macroeconomist Qiao Hong said on Monday.
The consumer price index could rise 2.6 percent in 2010, Qiao told a media briefing.
Goldman Sachs has estimated China's CPI will fall 0.9 percent year-on-year this year.
China's performance will be better than other countries because China realized the importance of expanding domestic demand, Jim O'Neill, head of global economic research at Goldman Sachs, said at the media briefing.
The global downturn meant an opportunity because it forced China to shake off its export-oriented strategy to boost growth and turn its attention to domestic demand, O'Neill said.
Goldman Sachs expected China's domestic demand to grow 13.3 percent year-on-year in 2009 and 13.6 percent in 2010.
China is less dependent on Western countries than it used to be, O'Neill said, adding that compared with major Western economies, China was less affected by the global financial crisis.
China will perform much better in the future, O'Neill said, adding he is very upbeat about China's development prospects.
China will soon surpass Japan to become the world's second-largest economy, O'Neill said, without giving a specific year.
O'Neill said China would become the world's biggest economy in 2027, with GDP reaching about US$21 trillion. Domestic consumption will contribute about US$9 to US$10 trillion, he added.
Domestic consumption, which now accounts for about 37 percent of China's GDP, has huge growth potential, O'Neill said.
China's economy expanded 7.7 percent in the first nine months, with GDP totaling 21.8 trillion yuan.
1 yuan = 14 U.S. cents
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homer5
2252 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:00:18 AM
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| The problem with Chinese government economic stats is I trust them less than I trust U.S. stats... |
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benjamin
6966 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:03:20 AM
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| Goldman Suchks |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:16:09 AM
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| Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot |
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benjamin
6966 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:24:32 AM
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I beg to differ. We have stuff from countries I can't even spell, let alone knew existed.
Once it is gone, it is American or nothing. |
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:30:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
Isn't it funny how the government thinks we should pay taxes thru the nose for nothing just because they say so, but they won't tax the trade deficit to get our economy rolling. If they did we wouldn't have to borrow from the Chinese. |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:32:32 AM
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I would love to see that. Wait, we still have demshyt and repshyt parties out there? ahh scratch that thought.
quote:
Originally posted by rudeness
quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
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Gabriels
343 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:46:00 AM
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| If you think we cant compete now, wait till cap and trade passes. What advantage will countries like China, India, and others have when our businesses are having the sh8t taxed out of them. We are so screwed on so many levels! |
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GetLoans4me
2700 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:50:28 AM
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Gabriels,
blame our demshyt and repshyt parties.. They don't want to hear your ideas. We will NEVER taxed the shyt out of foreignes.. nah uhh |
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benjamin
6966 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 11:03:33 AM
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| Barney Frank is on CNBC right now, I can barely understand him. |
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nw@8brook
538 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 8:12:14 PM
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turn on close caption. I have to do that whenver I try to understand what mumbles (mayor of boston) speak on tv.
quote:
Originally posted by benjamin
Barney Frank is on CNBC right now, I can barely understand him.
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Jonas
1217 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 12:04:11 AM
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That sounds like a roadblock to free markets. Change of heart? I thought you were all about the Capitalism.
Hows about we take the hint that manufacturing is dying down and man up as a nation and get an education. Sorry, thoughtless line jobs assembling stuff won't be available for those unwilling to ascend intellectually. Time to sink or swim.
Oh, and ethnocentric ideals are actually a disadvantage in this global economy. Whoops. Better get that checked out.
quote:
Originally posted by rudeness
quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
Isn't it funny how the government thinks we should pay taxes thru the nose for nothing just because they say so, but they won't tax the trade deficit to get our economy rolling. If they did we wouldn't have to borrow from the Chinese.
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toddblue
4344 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 01:16:32 AM
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Yea!!
Jonas wins
The same whiners that cry about taxes think taxation of imports is the answer. It is not.
We must provide a better product at a better value than the other countries. That is Global Capitalism. Let other countries subsidize their unions, their government programs and their inferior products. They will go broke.
Maintain Reinstate our free enterprise system, get our government out of businesses way and we win. Keeep dolars in the pockets of consumers and away from government programs and we excel. That's what made us a great nation. That is what will keep us a great nation.
quote:
Originally posted by Jonas
That sounds like a roadblock to free markets. Change of heart? I thought you were all about the Capitalism.
Hows about we take the hint that manufacturing is dying down and man up as a nation and get an education. Sorry, thoughtless line jobs assembling stuff won't be available for those unwilling to ascend intellectually. Time to sink or swim.
Oh, and ethnocentric ideals are actually a disadvantage in this global economy. Whoops. Better get that checked out.
quote:
Originally posted by rudeness
quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
Isn't it funny how the government thinks we should pay taxes thru the nose for nothing just because they say so, but they won't tax the trade deficit to get our economy rolling. If they did we wouldn't have to borrow from the Chinese.
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 04:55:34 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Jonas
That sounds like a roadblock to free markets. Change of heart? I thought you were all about the Capitalism.
Hows about we take the hint that manufacturing is dying down and man up as a nation and get an education. Sorry, thoughtless line jobs assembling stuff won't be available for those unwilling to ascend intellectually. Time to sink or swim.
Oh, and ethnocentric ideals are actually a disadvantage in this global economy. Whoops. Better get that checked out.
quote:
Originally posted by rudeness
quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
Isn't it funny how the government thinks we should pay taxes thru the nose for nothing just because they say so, but they won't tax the trade deficit to get our economy rolling. If they did we wouldn't have to borrow from the Chinese.
I am all about capitalism in the US, but what makes you think I give 2 shiits about it in China. We are not competing on a level playing field because minimum wage requirements and unions put an end to free market competition years ago.
Saying how about we get an education sounds good on the surface, but the fact is that we have tens of millions of Americans that aren't bright enough to get an education and either need manual labor type jobs or welfare. I vote for manual labor type jobs because I'm not willing to support them. If you think that our economy and citizens should suffer so that the Chinese can prosper, you really need to rethink your plan. |
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 05:00:08 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by toddblue
Yea!!
Jonas wins
The same whiners that cry about taxes think taxation of imports is the answer. It is not.
We must provide a better product at a better value than the other countries. That is Global Capitalism. Let other countries subsidize their unions, their government programs and their inferior products. They will go broke.
Maintain Reinstate our free enterprise system, get our government out of businesses way and we win. Keeep dolars in the pockets of consumers and away from government programs and we excel. That's what made us a great nation. That is what will keep us a great nation.
quote:
Originally posted by Jonas
That sounds like a roadblock to free markets. Change of heart? I thought you were all about the Capitalism.
Hows about we take the hint that manufacturing is dying down and man up as a nation and get an education. Sorry, thoughtless line jobs assembling stuff won't be available for those unwilling to ascend intellectually. Time to sink or swim.
Oh, and ethnocentric ideals are actually a disadvantage in this global economy. Whoops. Better get that checked out.
quote:
Originally posted by rudeness
quote:
Originally posted by GetLoans4me
Say what you want to say crap about China but before you make an azz out of yourself, take a good look at your household items.. 60% are made from china.. That explains a lot
That's exactly the problem. Anything that is in the deficit portion of trade with China should be taxed to death, so that it would become profitable to start making American products again.
Isn't it funny how the government thinks we should pay taxes thru the nose for nothing just because they say so, but they won't tax the trade deficit to get our economy rolling. If they did we wouldn't have to borrow from the Chinese.
Jonas wins what? The US citizens are losing and all you can say is Yea... Jonas Wins? Both of you need to stop concerning yourself with the world economy and start seriously thinking about how to protect our asses here at home. Since you seem to think that this world economy is so great and that we should be more concerned with China's earnings rather than our own, why don't you tell me who in this grand world economy will be coming to the rescue of the good ole USA? |
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1stintegritymort
1791 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 05:30:43 AM
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Free trade is not going anywhere. If you tax any imports, then that country will tax U.S exports. It will become a trade war with tariffs. The problem with China is that their currency is undervalued and that puts them at a big advantage. The weak U.S Dollar makes our exports more affordable for other countries to purchase U.S products. You don't want to go down the road of taxing imports. It will cause more problems then solving anything. Our problem is that the U.S economy is debt driven. Consumer spending is not driven by savings, but by debt reflected in real estate, credit cards, car loans, etc. Prices are too high and people do not have the money to pay. The only way to solve this problem is for prices to go down so that people can actually afford what they buy. We need prices to go down and the U.S Dollar to go back up and retain its value. We need interest rates to go up. Artificially low rates has stalled the economy and thrown us in a similar predicament as Japan with a lost decade. The current decade has been a mirage of wealth and prosperity. It will continue to take years to rebuild this country until the Gov't faces reality.
Concerning factory orders, the problem with these numbers is that the summer months is when production should be at its peak. The numbers remain flat during the period that it should grow. This winter is going to be very telling since that is the dead season. I don't see how orders will expand when businesses continue to keep inventories down. Retailers are still predicting a decrease in spending this holiday season. Rightfully so, people don't have the funds to pay for presents, vacations, etc. It most certainly explains why hotels and resorts are closing down since people are not traveling like they used to. Retailers are prepared for this and have cleared out inventory the past year and have not stocked up like they have before.
We definitely need manual labor type jobs to support those that don't have the education for a skilled job. The other part of the problem is that some of the skilled jobs are going overseas because you can still pay them peanuts for the same job. You are seeing jobs go overseas as U.S companies continue to expand in emerging markets. They see emerging markets as an investment opportunity and can make more money over there. Just look at the stock market and you will see the companies that are doing business overseas are prospering and the ones staying in the U.S are suffering. You can't solve the problem with protectionism. I am not sure how else you would solve the problem other then creating incentives to keep businesses in the U.S.
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darkstar
26266 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 05:43:06 AM
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>>>>You don't want to go down the road of taxing imports. It will cause more problems then solving anything.
I agree, but Obama doesn't as he already put a 35% tariff on Chinese tires and in turn they put tariffs on some crap of ours(can't remember what specifically)...
You know Carter is happy he lived to see the day someone would replace him at the bottom... |
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 06:10:34 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by 1stintegritymortgage
Free trade is not going anywhere. If you tax any imports, then that country will tax U.S exports. It will become a trade war with tariffs. The problem with China is that their currency is undervalued and that puts them at a big advantage. The weak U.S Dollar makes our exports more affordable for other countries to purchase U.S products. You don't want to go down the road of taxing imports. It will cause more problems then solving anything. Our problem is that the U.S economy is debt driven. Consumer spending is not driven by savings, but by debt reflected in real estate, credit cards, car loans, etc. Prices are too high and people do not have the money to pay. The only way to solve this problem is for prices to go down so that people can actually afford what they buy. We need prices to go down and the U.S Dollar to go back up and retain its value. We need interest rates to go up. Artificially low rates has stalled the economy and thrown us in a similar predicament as Japan with a lost decade. The current decade has been a mirage of wealth and prosperity. It will continue to take years to rebuild this country until the Gov't faces reality.
Concerning factory orders, the problem with these numbers is that the summer months is when production should be at its peak. The numbers remain flat during the period that it should grow. This winter is going to be very telling since that is the dead season. I don't see how orders will expand when businesses continue to keep inventories down. Retailers are still predicting a decrease in spending this holiday season. Rightfully so, people don't have the funds to pay for presents, vacations, etc. It most certainly explains why hotels and resorts are closing down since people are not traveling like they used to. Retailers are prepared for this and have cleared out inventory the past year and have not stocked up like they have before.
We definitely need manual labor type jobs to support those that don't have the education for a skilled job. The other part of the problem is that some of the skilled jobs are going overseas because you can still pay them peanuts for the same job. You are seeing jobs go overseas as U.S companies continue to expand in emerging markets. They see emerging markets as an investment opportunity and can make more money over there. Just look at the stock market and you will see the companies that are doing business overseas are prospering and the ones staying in the U.S are suffering. You can't solve the problem with protectionism. I am not sure how else you would solve the problem other then creating incentives to keep businesses in the U.S.
Free trade is fine until we get into a never ending cycle of deficits. You are correct that the Chinese are manipulating their currency and intentionally keep it under valued, so why should we be obligated to play fair? When the Chinese have 4x's our population, but only import 1/4 of what they export to us, there's a huge problem. Fair trade would a dollar for dollar trade, tax exempt, with the deficit balance highly taxed. |
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homebroker@sbcgl
7371 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 06:54:44 AM
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Is this a month over month or year over year calculation. What is the basis of this .09 increase?
quote:
Originally posted by craigppls
Factory orders number shows a nice gain. Inventories still shrinking and the factory orders number isn't all autos.
Inventory rebuilding will have to start sometime, will help economy.
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craigppls
2116 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 07:04:09 AM
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5 out of the last 6 months the factory order numbers are up...
Is that a trend??? |
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rudeness
5407 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 07:40:27 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by craigppls
5 out of the last 6 months the factory order numbers are up...
Is that a trend???
Not when at least 2 of those months were manipulated by C4C and we're still down 25% from a year ago. |
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