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Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 4:43:32 PM

I'm not big on using this argument against HVCC, in fact, it flat out stinks, but I'll take the publicity:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/03/AR2009070301194.html

I don't like the Washington Post, but I thank them for running this article.

Dave...

jchvw9

73 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 5:04:11 PM

Great article and oh so true.
Let me tell you about one that happened to me a while back. I had a property we were trying to finance in WA, great house, great borrowers. The appraisal was taking forever and I called the gentleman to ask him what the status was and try to light a fire under him. He assures me that everything is perfect on the property and that my borrowers are getting a steal on the place. He says, "I can't actually give you an exact value until I submit this thing, but I can safely say that your borrowers are going to walking away from the closing table with 50-60k in instant equity." I said awesome, I can't wait to get the appraisal in. The next day when it comes in, it is 1,000 over the purchase price. I gave the gent another call and asked what happened to their 50-60k in equity? He responded by letting me know that high appraisals are what got us into this housing mess and that he would get in a lot of trouble if he wrote up an appraisal like that! We closed the transaction and I filed a formal complaint, but nothing ever came from it. Also, this was not this guys first day. He had been in the industry for 30 years but that didn't keep him from doing what he did. If you want to stop messing up this market, why not do a legitimate appraisal. Maybe I have a different outlook towards business, but if you use honesty and integrity in all of your transactions, no matter what business you may be in, will not only help your own wealth, it will strengthen the industry across the board.

Sorry for the rant.

Boulderco

1775 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 5:14:32 PM

You know you'll get flamed by the usual suspects. When you can't get two appraisers to agree on the value of a property, and it simply doesn't happen in the absence of them being told an estimated value, why won't they at least acknowledge that they are often wrong? If the other appraiser comes in high, the low baller accuses him of fraud. If it comes in low, the other appraiser accuses him of being an idiot. Every appraiser can't be right. We had an appraisal come in at $430,000 and a second come in at $300,000. You can't buy a property on the golf course in the Westwoods subdivision in Arvada Colorado for $300,000. I suppose if you keep getting these kinds of appraisals, eventually you will though.

This was a case of government overfixing a problem, and now the unintended consequences are rearing their ugly heads.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 5:31:09 PM

That last sentence above? OUTSTANDING.

And no need to apologize for the above rant, either. We need to hear these things.

Dave...

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 6:37:54 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Adept Appraisal

I'm not big on using this argument against HVCC, in fact, it flat out stinks, but I'll take the publicity:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/03/AR2009070301194.html

I don't like the Washington Post, but I thank them for running this article.

Dave...

You're such a whore.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 6:42:28 PM

And I can't believe you don't see the utter stupidity of the above two posts. You're not a colleague or peer of mine. You have no sense of right or wrong, you have no self-respect and you have no respect for your license or what it means.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/03/2009 : 6:42:36 PM

Hoppy said:

"You're such a whore.'

Nice. Made a prophet out of Boulder, too boot.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 09:34:25 AM

The writer of the article made it clear he doesn't understand appraisal issues here:

In Wilmington, N.C., a loan applicant with a house in excellent condition and an unblemished payment record sought to refinance into a 4.75 percent mortgage. She bought the property four years ago for $160,000 and made about $20,000 worth of improvements. Her loan application, according to Paul Skeens, president of Colonial Mortgage Group of Waldorf, was "a slam dunk -- nothing to it." The house was worth $180,000 to $200,000, according to a local realty estimate.

Gee, I wonder where he got $180k for a value opinion? Just because the owner made 20k work of improvements doesn't necessarily mean the house went up 20k in value.

I'm sure that's not how you do appraisals Dave. The fact that you would emphasize an article like this, an article that contributes to the public's misunderstanding of the valuation process, erodes the tiny bit of regard I had left for you. This just shows how willing you are to compromise yourself to get what you want. This and the people you consort with. Yes you are friends with some "big name" appraisers(am I supposed to be impressed?)but you are also linking arms with some people who would say or do anything for a buck and who are not sympathetic at all to appraisal inflation issues. Issues that have contributed to the housing/financial crash of this country.

If a moratorium takes place, most brokers will go back to asking you to compromise(which you have shown again that you are willing to do) and do things that could cause you to lose your license, get sued or land you in prison. They are not your friends Dave. I wish you could see it.

PCE PCE PCE

Boulderco

1775 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:13:18 AM

quote:
Originally posted by ritabradley01
If a moratorium takes place, most brokers will go back to asking you to compromise(which you have shown again that you are willing to do) and do things that could cause you to lose your license, get sued or land you in prison. They are not your friends Dave. I wish you could see it.

PCE PCE PCE

Like I said in my earlier post, if the other appraiser comes in higher, you're saying he's committing fraud. Is this because your opinion of value is infallible? If you, and any other appraiser went out and did separate blind appraisals on 100 properties, I'll bet you would come in with different values on 90 to 100 of them. Is it because the other appraiser is a fraud if he's higher or an idiot because he's lower? Have you ever had a reviewer lower one of your values? Have you ever lowered someone else's value who wasn't a fraud?

Sarge

201 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:33:44 AM

Boulder, I think most appraisers would agree that the odds of hitting the same number as another appraiser is not common. There will always be differences. However, if two competent appraisers appraised the same home, they ought to be darn close (within 5%). That IMO is when the underwriter needs to step in and make a decision as to which one they feel the most comfortable using.

When you see two appraisals an one is 400K and the other is 300K, one or both of the appraisers is not competent. It is then time to get a 3rd opinion. (Sorta like one doctor saying you have cancer and the 2nd saying you do not. It is time to see a 3rd doctor.)

jch....sorry you ran into an unprofessional jerk. He was totally wrong, he should appraise the house for what it is, not what he thinks someone expects. If it is high, so be it. If it is low, so be it. Honesty is the best policy, even when it does cost you many many clients.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 10:39:57 AM

I don' think anyone said the higher value is always fraud. Let's not put words in people's mouths.

One of the points of my post was that person quoted said the $180k+ value was "a slam dunk" because the owner bought the property for $160k and did $20k worth of improvements. This is a faulty way of deriving a value opinion.

The most commonly used technique for residential appraisers to use in forming a credible opinion opinion of value is the market approach. If you're not familiar with it, I hope you'll google it. Knowledgeable buyers in the homeowner's area may or may not be willing to pay $20k extra for her home because she made improvements to it (especially if the value of homes in that area had dropped over the last few years-I don't know if that's the case or not but it's something that MUST be considered.) We don't even know what the improvements are-they may not even be improvements most buyers would appreciate.

There are very few "slam dunks" in the valuation field. There are many factors that must be considered.

canoe

251 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:08:55 AM

The issue is not "low appraisals" the issue is appraisers who are being sent from 200 miles away who have no geographic competence and may only be a trainee or inexperienced appraiser. Since May, 1 2009 the reviews I have completed are clearly indicating that many AMCs are choosing the lowest priced appraiser, the appraisers level of expertice or his or her location or geographic competence was not a factor in this assignment. I compleetd a review last week , the home was a 6,500 Sq Ft located on 10 acres of land, the home was new construction and the appraiser assigned to the report was from 150 miles away, she was Certified but had never appraised a home in the "subjects" market area.

The appraisal was $300,000 to $350,000 lower than any similar sale in that market place, I spoke with the appraiser and she was very upset at both me the reviewer and the lender, after a few minutes of chit chat I felt very sorry for her because she was simply in over her head and frankly she should have rejected the assignment based on her lack of experience in custom homes.

I did not make any value decision on the review I simply recommended that the lender have another appraisal completed by someone who had a working knowledge of the subjects market area.

There were so many problems with the report besides value that it just did not seem possible to have the original appraiser clean the mess up . I have noticed that many appraisers simply make up a low number when they have no idea what a property is worth, many are under the assumtion that a "low "value can make up for their lack of ability to appraise a complex property.

The market has been flooded with appraisers being paid from $150.00 to $200.00 to complete fairly complex homes. I spoke with another appraiser on Wed afternoon he was a very nice young man and when I asked him a question about uspap , he replied that he really didn't pay much attention to uspap other than every 2 years when he took his online 7 hour class.

many on this forum simply do not understand that HVCC opened the flood gates for the AMCs to use cheap and fast , the quality is not as important as the quality. I would say to the "ritas" of the world, get a license then sign up with a few of the larger AMCs and see how much pressure they place on the appraiser, they want fast and cheap and see how long you last on there approved list if you don't hit the numbers ???

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 11:40:02 AM

quote:
many on this forum simply do not understand that HVCC opened the flood gates for the AMCs to use cheap and fast , the quality is not as important as the quality. I would say to the "ritas" of the world, get a license then sign up with a few of the larger AMCs and see how much pressure they place on the appraiser, they want fast and cheap and see how long you last on there approved list if you don't hit the numbers ???

Let's here some more about cause and effect. Does an AMC care what an appraiser charges as long as the AMC makes the same amount of profit? What's driving the low fees? I say it's the AMC's clients (lenders and now brokers) that are driving this. They know the AMC business model. But the lenders want fast and the lenders want cheap. So do the brokers (just read the posts on this forum for a couple of years). Lenders don't even really care about quality. That's why they insist that appraisers carry E&O policies. (For the record, E&O is for the appraiser's benefit and should not be any of the appraiser's client's business but it is being exploited because they see it as a trade off for lack of quality).

Appraisers who specialize in mortgage lending work can make a decent living at about $300 to $400 a pop. They can do this because there is some consistency in the development and reporting and because to a degree residential properties have much in common with each other. But that is about as low as possible and still do the required due diligence and regulatory housekeeping. Below that threshold something has to give.

This sets up a conflict that can't be resolved and demonstrates the hypocracy of the GSE's (fannie and freddie) and the dishonesty of lenders (who know better but don't act to resolve the conflict.) Appraiser's are prohibit from justifying lack of proper due diligence by the attitude "you get what you pay for" and lenders are responsible for knowing this. Anyone with a brain can see the logic and if FNMA had someone with a brain or could hire someone logical they would take steps to make sure their own policies were being carried out. Before implementing HVCC they should have taken steps to make sure AMC's were adequately regulated and competent to manage the process of appraisal management.

quote:
XI, 402: Market Data Research (08/24/03)

The appraiser is responsible for adequately researching market data from all reasonably available and appropriate sources of information for the location and property type being appraised (including public records transfer information and, if appropriate, data from local real estate brokers who are not active in the local multiple listing service)—even if this results in the appraiser spending more time and incurring additional expenses in performing appraisal assignments in certain geographic locations or for particular property types. If the appraiser does not consider all relevant data, overlooks relevant data sources, or relies on incomplete data in the research and analysis stage of the appraisal process, the result may be a poor quality appraisal that could have a discriminatory effect. For example, when the only data that is researched and relied on is data obtained from a sales data reporting service or a local multiple listing service—and that data source was not used for most of the sales transactions in a particular neighborhood or market area—the appraiser may arrive at an inaccurate opinion of value. For specific information concerning sources of manufactured housing data, please refer to Section 304.01.

For the record I would be in favor of suspending HVCC until the AMC issue is resolved satisfactorily.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 1:16:51 PM

quote:
Originally posted by canoe

The issue is not "low appraisals" the issue is appraisers who are being sent from 200 miles away who have no geographic competence and may only be a trainee or inexperienced appraiser. Since May, 1 2009 the reviews I have completed are clearly indicating that many AMCs are choosing the lowest priced appraiser, the appraisers level of expertice or his or her location or geographic competence was not a factor in this assignment. I compleetd a review last week , the home was a 6,500 Sq Ft located on 10 acres of land, the home was new construction and the appraiser assigned to the report was from 150 miles away, she was Certified but had never appraised a home in the "subjects" market area.

The appraisal was $300,000 to $350,000 lower than any similar sale in that market place, I spoke with the appraiser and she was very upset at both me the reviewer and the lender, after a few minutes of chit chat I felt very sorry for her because she was simply in over her head and frankly she should have rejected the assignment based on her lack of experience in custom homes.

I did not make any value decision on the review I simply recommended that the lender have another appraisal completed by someone who had a working knowledge of the subjects market area.

There were so many problems with the report besides value that it just did not seem possible to have the original appraiser clean the mess up . I have noticed that many appraisers simply make up a low number when they have no idea what a property is worth, many are under the assumtion that a "low "value can make up for their lack of ability to appraise a complex property.

The market has been flooded with appraisers being paid from $150.00 to $200.00 to complete fairly complex homes. I spoke with another appraiser on Wed afternoon he was a very nice young man and when I asked him a question about uspap , he replied that he really didn't pay much attention to uspap other than every 2 years when he took his online 7 hour class.

many on this forum simply do not understand that HVCC opened the flood gates for the AMCs to use cheap and fast , the quality is not as important as the quality. I would say to the "ritas" of the world, get a license then sign up with a few of the larger AMCs and see how much pressure they place on the appraiser, they want fast and cheap and see how long you last on there approved list if you don't hit the numbers ???

So how ARE you licensed and certified appraisers staying in business these days Glenn? You told me you aren't keen on working with non-lenders like attorneys so how do you stay in business oh great Certified One? Hitting numbers? Or are you out of business now? Your cert may not be worth the paper it's written on soon, I don't know why you make such a big deal about it. All my appraiser friends I started in the business with are certified now. Big deal.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 1:26:29 PM

I am not a fan of HVCC the way it is currently being implemented but I'm not in favor of the moratorium. Those clowns have had more than enough time to get it together.

AlbertSmythe48

466 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 2:48:16 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Adept Appraisal

I'm not big on using this argument against HVCC, in fact, it flat out stinks, but I'll take the publicity:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/03/AR2009070301194.html

I don't like the Washington Post, but I thank them for running this article.

Dave...

You ever notice that they always talk to the lenders in these articles and never talk to the appraisers? Why is that?

AlbertSmythe48

466 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 2:52:30 PM

quote:
Originally posted by jchvw9

Great article and oh so true.
Let me tell you about one that happened to me a while back. I had a property we were trying to finance in WA, great house, great borrowers. The appraisal was taking forever and I called the gentleman to ask him what the status was and try to light a fire under him. He assures me that everything is perfect on the property and that my borrowers are getting a steal on the place. He says, "I can't actually give you an exact value until I submit this thing, but I can safely say that your borrowers are going to walking away from the closing table with 50-60k in instant equity." I said awesome, I can't wait to get the appraisal in. The next day when it comes in, it is 1,000 over the purchase price. I gave the gent another call and asked what happened to their 50-60k in equity? He responded by letting me know that high appraisals are what got us into this housing mess and that he would get in a lot of trouble if he wrote up an appraisal like that! We closed the transaction and I filed a formal complaint, but nothing ever came from it. Also, this was not this guys first day. He had been in the industry for 30 years but that didn't keep him from doing what he did. If you want to stop messing up this market, why not do a legitimate appraisal. Maybe I have a different outlook towards business, but if you use honesty and integrity in all of your transactions, no matter what business you may be in, will not only help your own wealth, it will strengthen the industry across the board.

Sorry for the rant.

AlbertSmythe48

466 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 2:57:07 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

For the record I would be in favor of suspending HVCC until the AMC issue is resolved satisfactorily.

THE AMC ISSUE WILL NEVER BE RESOLVED SATISFACTORILY!!!

Annemieke Roell

1095 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2009 : 5:04:28 PM

quote:
Originally posted by AlbertSmythe48

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

For the record I would be in favor of suspending HVCC until the AMC issue is resolved satisfactorily.

THE AMC ISSUE WILL NEVER BE RESOLVED SATISFACTORILY!!!

And even IF the HVCC is halted for the next 18 months, I seriously doubt that lenders are going to pull out of using AMCs which they spent time and money setting up with.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2009 : 6:26:17 PM

I'm fine with that too but whose e & o will lenders sue if there are no appraisers.

Boulderco

1775 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2009 : 11:49:46 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Annemieke Roell

quote:
Originally posted by AlbertSmythe48

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

For the record I would be in favor of suspending HVCC until the AMC issue is resolved satisfactorily.

THE AMC ISSUE WILL NEVER BE RESOLVED SATISFACTORILY!!!

And even IF the HVCC is halted for the next 18 months, I seriously doubt that lenders are going to pull out of using AMCs which they spent time and money setting up with.

Lenders that have AMCs may find themselves losing business which may be more expensive than disbanding an AMC. Setting up an AMC isn't like building an airport or a new freeway. What do they have invested, a contract to utilize a call center in India, some software and a couple of filing cabinets? I don't think anyone built an office building to house their AMC.

jchvw9

73 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 07:18:08 AM

[/quote]
Let's pretend that the appraisal did come in 50k - 60k over the sale price. They didn't get 50 to 60k in instant equity! They just dropped the values in the neighborhood 50 - 60k! He just became the best comp in the neighborhood for the next "low-balling" appraiser.
[/quote]

The reason I said that like that is because all of the comps in the neighborhood support a value of 50-60k over the purchase price. Also, since the transaction has closed, the RE agent has sent me links to more comps on the neighborhood that continue to support the higher value. Either way, instant equity was a poor choice of words, my bad. Still though, the appraiser screwed us and everyone else in the neighborhood on value and it's not ok.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 07:26:16 AM

Let's just suppose for a minute that the appraiser did "screw" everyone. Can you tell me what his motivation to do that was?

I just can't imagine why an appraiser would risk his license, just to screw a bunch of people he doesn't know.

quote:
Originally posted by jchvw9

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 07:35:38 AM

You're losing it, Rita. If you think Dana and Darren are the same people you are absolutely losing it.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 08:01:41 AM

The slash could also indicate: It doesn't matter or that she doesn't know. Rita is not losing it. She's just presenting information and opinion. Same as you.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 08:08:36 AM

No, she's losing it, and people like you have helped make that happen. At the end of the day it's her choice, but to allow herself to be transformed into a liar and a nut is a partial reflection on you and other ubers here.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 08:11:08 AM

Please post the lies she has told.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:16:56 AM

I would, Greg, accept that you would either not understand them or avoid the obvious truths contained in them. I'm still waiting for an explanation from you as to why you were unable to count to 2, and until that gets cleared up you're just whistling Dixie with any new requests tougher than that.

Dave...

Annemieke Roell

1095 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:23:02 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Boulderco

quote:
Originally posted by Annemieke Roell

quote:
Originally posted by AlbertSmythe48

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

For the record I would be in favor of suspending HVCC until the AMC issue is resolved satisfactorily.

THE AMC ISSUE WILL NEVER BE RESOLVED SATISFACTORILY!!!

And even IF the HVCC is halted for the next 18 months, I seriously doubt that lenders are going to pull out of using AMCs which they spent time and money setting up with.

Lenders that have AMCs may find themselves losing business which may be more expensive than disbanding an AMC. Setting up an AMC isn't like building an airport or a new freeway. What do they have invested, a contract to utilize a call center in India, some software and a couple of filing cabinets? I don't think anyone built an office building to house their AMC.

I was talking about lenders who went through time, trouble and expenses to USE AMCs.

Annemieke Roell

1095 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:25:20 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Adept Appraisal

I would, Greg, accept that you would either not understand them or avoid the obvious truths contained in them. I'm still waiting for an explanation from you as to why you were unable to count to 2, and until that gets cleared up you're just whistling Dixie with any new requests tougher than that.

Dave...

Greg, have you ever noticed that the fewer answers Dave has, the more obnoxious he becomes? It is a sign of desperation.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:32:14 AM

Ann, have you ever noticed that you're a really mean person? Greg can't count to two, and I saw that plainly illustrated. So did every one else who read that exchange. He wrote a post, containing exactly two questions, and became indignant when I pointed that out despite his insistence that there was only one.

Ann, are you okay? Have you, perhaps, even ONE solitary unbiased bone in your body? Hmmmmm? Wise up, Ann. Greg doesn't want answers, he needs help, why not try to help him for a change.

Dave...

lemeuss

1842 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:40:07 AM

quote:
Originally posted by ritabradley01

I don' think anyone said the higher value is always fraud. Let's not put words in people's mouths.

One of the points of my post was that person quoted said the $180k+ value was "a slam dunk" because the owner bought the property for $160k and did $20k worth of improvements. This is a faulty way of deriving a value opinion.

The most commonly used technique for residential appraisers to use in forming a credible opinion opinion of value is the market approach. If you're not familiar with it, I hope you'll google it. Knowledgeable buyers in the homeowner's area may or may not be willing to pay $20k extra for her home because she made improvements to it (especially if the value of homes in that area had dropped over the last few years-I don't know if that's the case or not but it's something that MUST be considered.) We don't even know what the improvements are-they may not even be improvements most buyers would appreciate.

There are very few "slam dunks" in the valuation field. There are many factors that must be considered.

Rita, it says that value is from local real estate models. Sounds realistic (assuming normal housing market) as the property was bought 4 years ago, at the height of appreciation. Likely gained a ton of value in the first 2 years, then started seeing value diminish.....I doubt there was any intent to peg value based on improvements.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 09:54:02 AM

Dave... the question was "what do mean by ....?" The second question was "or should that be a topic for a different thread in the off topic forum?"

You did not directly answer either question so the original question was still relevant. I didn't need to answer your question about whether or not I can count to two becaue it was obviously rhetorical and a snide way of evading my question.

You're like a little girl who can't get her way, feels she has no power or control and is now pouting, weeping and resorting to calling those she perceives as being bullies liars.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 10:31:50 AM

More names and insults from a guy who inappropriately uses the word "whore" and then tries to defend it. Do you actually expect me to take you seriously after all this, Greg? You are a child. Her are your exact words:

"But then I remembered there was only one question and one statement of opinion."

You told me there was ONE question in that post of yours, but now you see two. Are you admitting you made a mistake? Perhaps that's as close as you're able to muster.

AlbertSmythe48

466 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 10:34:52 AM

New movie coming out...The Road To HVCC...staring Dave, Greg and Anne A comedy show in honor of The Road movies staring Bob, Bing and Dorothy...

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 10:37:42 AM

Yeah, but those guys were FRIENDS! That would be a horror flick!

;^)

Scrooge McDuck

15035 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 10:45:06 AM

this post is great. can i site this thread and post this link the next time the angry appraiser squad jumps down someone's throat fro suggesting they got a low appraisal?

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 10:51:13 AM

What does "low appraisal" mean?

Scrooge McDuck

15035 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:08:57 AM

that it is lower then market value. like the guy who had the crappy appraiser who gave a house a $300,000 appraisal in the neighborhood where all the hosues sold for $430,000.

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

What does "low appraisal" mean?

AK__47

1629 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:10:37 AM

quote:
Originally posted by jchvw9

Let's pretend that the appraisal did come in 50k - 60k over the sale price. They didn't get 50 to 60k in instant equity! They just dropped the values in the neighborhood 50 - 60k! He just became the best comp in the neighborhood for the next "low-balling" appraiser.
[/quote]

The reason I said that like that is because all of the comps in the neighborhood support a value of 50-60k over the purchase price. Also, since the transaction has closed, the RE agent has sent me links to more comps on the neighborhood that continue to support the higher value. Either way, instant equity was a poor choice of words, my bad. Still though, the appraiser screwed us and everyone else in the neighborhood on value and it's not ok.
[/quote]

How did the appraiser screw anyone out of any equity? Nobody in that neighborhood will ever know what the house appraised for, and none will ever base the value of other houses off what that house appraised for. The person who sold the house for that cheap is the only one who screwed anyone out of future value. You said the appraisal came in over the PP right? so whats your issue? How did this change anything with your transaction? Sounds like you are new to the business. Why would the relitter care what the house appraised for? Did the buyer want to back out because it didnt appraise high enough?

Boulderco

1775 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:13:28 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

What does "low appraisal" mean?

I think that line speaks volumes.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:14:20 AM

quote:
The person who sold the house for that cheap is the only one who screwed anyone out of future value.

Even then he didn't screw anyone out of any value because one sale is just one sale and does not determine market value.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:21:42 AM

Dave you probably haven't been on here long enough to know this but there are a lot of nutballs on this site who have more than one screen name. I'm cracking up just thinking about it. I even used to joke around sometimes asking:

Does Darkstar=Darin?

Does Mosolo=Madonna? I believe Madonna ended up being pretty legit-still not sure about Darkstar ;)

It's mostly a joke. Don't worry, I'm still relatively sane. Just wasting too much time on silliness, that's all.

Dave, I'm sorry if I seemed to turn on you. You're a very likable person and we probably agree on tons of other issues, it's just that as time has gone by, I've learned that you will even post erroneous information if it supports your cause and you are friendly with people who have done very thug-like things (more has been revealed since I met you, on other threads etc). I feel that you are being deceived but I do wish you a good future. I really mean that. It would be interesting to have a crystal ball where we could look 10 years into the future and see where we all end up. Hopefully this country will bear some resemblance to the country we have today but I fear it won't if thugs are allowed to continue their raping and pillaging of the poor and middle class.

quote:
Originally posted by Adept Appraisal

You're losing it, Rita. If you think Dana and Darren are the same people you are absolutely losing it.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:25:36 AM

quote:
You're a very likable person and we probably agree on tons of other issues,

Ditto.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:26:37 AM

More lies. I have never posted a piece of erroneous information here yet.

While I have been blatantly honest, and I may make a mistake from time to time in interpreting a person's post (intent), I do not lie, nor post "erroneous" stuff.

Rita, justify all you like, but don't pretend that I am buying any of it. You know what you've done, and you are wrong for having done so.

AK__47

1629 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:29:55 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Hopland

quote:
The person who sold the house for that cheap is the only one who screwed anyone out of future value.

Even then he didn't screw anyone out of any value because one sale is just one sale and does not determine market value.

Oh I completely agree, but if there is anyone to put any blame on for any change in the value of other home in that neighborhood its the seller,buyer, & listing agent. jchvw9 also says that the relitter is sending comops that are still selling higher after this house sold. This just proves that the market was not hurt by this one sale. So whats he so mad about? Now AI can understand if the appraiser said all that then came in below the pp.

ritabradley01

4945 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:42:14 AM

I'm not justifying anything but I AM starting to feel like I'm talking with someone who has a closed mind. You started a thread using a crappy article (you said yourself that the argument "flat out stinks") full of erroneous and questionable information. That's compromise. You compromised in your advertising. You advocate for people who have made nasty, threatening phone calls to LOs homes. A lot of the brokers I respect and trust on this board won't even associate with those people and that group anymore. I'm sorry but an honest appraiser working for an AMC (they do exist)looks pretty good to me in comparison to the kind of deception and bullying on your side of the fence.

Hopland

4085 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:43:44 AM

Until the appraiser determines these sales to be comparable they are just sales. Would the Realtor® be as quick to send any "comps" that sold for less if they were available? I highly doubt it.

Adept Appraisal

1613 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:44:47 AM

I have a closed mind for your mindless accusations, Rita, because I know better. So should you.

Jimmymackin

862 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 11:45:25 AM

this is just sad

LanceB

159 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2009 : 12:14:42 PM

OK, lets quit the bantering back and forth as it accomplishes nothing. If I am reading the original post correctly, the appraiser knew the value was higher (and correct at the higher value) but put a low value so no one (underwriter I assume) would question it. This is happening everywhere and I can't blame the appraisers as these underwriters are asking for a first born child to justify the values.

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