NEED HELP!!!!! COUNTERING THE UNDERWRITER

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hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:03:19 PM

borrower is a pastor and does not get paystubs and w-2s.

we've provided a pastor license, canceled checks to show income, and lender pulled 4506 and it showed that the pastor filed for income taxes from his previous job, where he no longer works and is now pastor full time.

UNDERWRITER IS REQUESTING A W-2.

i dont get it. is it normal for pastors to receive w-2s and paystubs? PLEASE HELP. HOW CAN WE COUNTER THIS?

jpar994

885 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:07:01 PM

I have done several Pastors and each is different but most of them do recieve a w2 and a paystub, the last one I did was stated and all I had to do is call the archdiosece and verify they are the pastor!

you may be out of luck!

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:13:05 PM

was that income part or entirely of his housing allowance?

in my case, the full amount is the housing allowance...

Carpet Muncher

1385 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:13:05 PM

The underwriter is stipping for this because most Pastors do get a W2. They are considered employees of their church. This allows them to receive benefits and also keeps them under the insurance protection of the church for liability purposes. This W2 income will generally not show any withholdings for income taxes or FICA.

kalee3415

196 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:20:51 PM

Pastors are paid in various ways. I have had paystubs & w2's. I have had no stubs or w2 instead using cancelled checks, a full VOE, and a letter from the treasurer of the church in regards to how they are paid. Clergy can be difficult. How long has he been there? How long has been a pastor? Is this FHA?

It is difficult to counter since things like this are u/w and lender discretion. If it is FHA and the concern is getting it insured at that income maybe you can get the green light from FHA. If it is conventional all you can do is explain it fully to a manager, make sure you have letter from the church & full VOE, and ask for an exception pointing out any other compensating factors.

May just have to pack it up and send it elsewhere. Good Luck!

quote:
Originally posted by hoangad

borrower is a pastor and does not get paystubs and w-2s.

we've provided a pastor license, canceled checks to show income, and lender pulled 4506 and it showed that the pastor filed for income taxes from his previous job, where he no longer works and is now pastor full time.

UNDERWRITER IS REQUESTING A W-2.

i dont get it. is it normal for pastors to receive w-2s and paystubs? PLEASE HELP. HOW CAN WE COUNTER THIS?

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:22:31 PM

he reported income under charity donations on the returns. shouldn't that be sufficient?

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 12:25:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by kalee3415

Pastors are paid in various ways. I have had paystubs & w2's. I have had no stubs or w2 instead using cancelled checks, a full VOE, and a letter from the treasurer of the church in regards to how they are paid. Clergy can be difficult. How long has he been there? How long has been a pastor? Is this FHA?

It is difficult to counter since things like this are u/w and lender discretion. If it is FHA and the concern is getting it insured at that income maybe you can get the green light from FHA. If it is conventional all you can do is explain it fully to a manager, make sure you have letter from the church & full VOE, and ask for an exception pointing out any other compensating factors.

May just have to pack it up and send it elsewhere. Good Luck!

quote:
Originally posted by hoangad

borrower is a pastor and does not get paystubs and w-2s.

we've provided a pastor license, canceled checks to show income, and lender pulled 4506 and it showed that the pastor filed for income taxes from his previous job, where he no longer works and is now pastor full time.

UNDERWRITER IS REQUESTING A W-2.

i dont get it. is it normal for pastors to receive w-2s and paystubs? PLEASE HELP. HOW CAN WE COUNTER THIS?

Thanks for your help!

I have a full VOE and letter that was sent to the lender.
They are being extremely difficult with this loan. I would not be fighting this if ALL pastors were required to have paystubs and/or w-2s, but NOT all of them do.

This is fannie mae EA LEVEL 3, which I know doesn't help too much...
Thanks again though...

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 1:24:58 PM

bump, help please. thanks!

americanheartlan

2237 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 1:29:15 PM

Who still does EA3's?

rtrefflich

3935 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 1:43:06 PM

Just wondering, if she ran a 4506 and got another job wouldn't it be hard to refi anyway since he is working in a totally different line of employment from where he was before?

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 1:50:49 PM

he's been a pastor for 3.5 years now.

jstar

743 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 2:26:24 PM

I recently closed a loan for a pastor and my underwriter would not accept the housing allowance as normal income unless the church administration issued a letter stating the housing allowance would continue for three years regardless of employment. Needless to say the church administration would not issue this letter. They rightfully wanted to avoid obligating themselves to future housing payments made to a person who potentially could longer work at the church. Luckily the DTI was in line with out the housing allowance and I just took it off the app.

The pastor did have W-2’s that showed regualar income with no taxes being collected and the housing allowance a seperate payments.

I still think the underwriter was wrong in her opinion regarding the housing allowance but I closed the loan and moved on.

I would double check with your UW regarding this.

hoangad

2937 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 8:19:34 PM

bump

KHufford

6516 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2008 : 9:39:18 PM