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dcreed
75 Posts |
 Posted - 05/12/2008 : 12:46:47 PM
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anyone doing stated retired besides Wachovia?????
have 2 scenarios with great ltv, credit and assets... need a home for these!!! |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 1:30:57 PM
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bump.....
am i not suplying enough info??? i dont understand why 15 people have opened this thread and have ZERO replyies????? |
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csmgcorp
603 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:03:33 PM
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| Why are you taking it stated? |
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sheriephillips
382 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:11:00 PM
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| Most lenders are worried about stated fixed income borrowers. This particular group of borrowers are usually not in a position to find increases to their income and it's considered prediatory lending to fund a loan for someone of limited means and without the ability to pay it back. |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:13:17 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Why are you taking it stated?
Dti is too high to go full doc.... |
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csmgcorp
603 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:16:58 PM
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Have you talked to them about going reverse mortgage?
Is it a cash-out or rate / term? |
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AGreene00
2578 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:21:41 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Why are you taking it stated?
Dti is too high to go full doc....
Well at least you are honest about it. |
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jsheldonwilliams
52 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:28:23 PM
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| thats the only lender i know.. Wachovia. others require another job and the fixed portion can only represent 50% of the total income being stated |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:29:48 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Have you talked to them about going reverse mortgage?
Is it a cash-out or rate / term?
1 of my scenarios is of the age of 52 and is on disabilty.... the other the reverse mortgage company that i usually use is saying they hve to come in with 90k to do a reverse... they owe 340k and the home is worth 600k.. |
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AndrewSoss
353 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:32:00 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Why are you taking it stated?
Dti is too high to go full doc....
then how are they going to pay the loan?
if they have significant assets, try an asset depletion loan through Wells. |
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mcmoney
245 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:33:10 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
bump.....
am i not suplying enough info??? i dont understand why 15 people have opened this thread and have ZERO replyies?????
If they have any type of self employment, you may have a shot.
That said, it is very rare (and usually not a good idea for the LO or borrower) to go "retired" stated. What you usually (can't speak 100% to your borrower) are dealing with is FIXED income stated. Hence the problem. There is NO reason to state fixed income. It is fixed. If you cannot DTI on fixed income (again, fixed income only with no side self employment) you are opening a huge can of worms trying to go stated.
The others suggesting reverse and asset depletion loans have viable and good suggestions.
There is absolutely no way I would push an app that was solely fixed income on a stated product. Just my $.02. |
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jsheldonwilliams
52 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 2:40:21 PM
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| you are just buying them time if you got them a stated loan with fixed income. |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 3:01:32 PM
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Look heres the deal.. both of my borrowers im trying to do loans for are in negitive am programs that are getting ready to RECAST. what im trying to do is buy them 5-10 yrs by cashing them out enough money to be able to survive in the lowest i/o payment fixed for 5-10 yrs. oterwise when the loan recasts they screwed! they will not be able to make the payment.
so i am open to all suggestions!! |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 3:02:46 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by AndrewSoss
quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Why are you taking it stated?
Dti is too high to go full doc....
then how are they going to pay the loan?
if they have significant assets, try an asset depletion loan through Wells.
any info on this would be great! never heard of it. |
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Cliff_Auerswald
363 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 3:47:26 PM
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the only viable and long term solution for seniors in an option arm AND on a fixed income is to take the government insured HECM. (Home Equity Conversion Mortgage)
If you would like to really make a positive impact on your borrowers lives ask them if they would like to stay in their homes for the rest of their lives without ever making a mortgage payment, and without ever loosing homeownership.
Putting them into a neg am where payments will inevitably increase is only a disservice to them. Since you said you are open to all suggestions I would like to run you a benefits package for each of them. I'll email you a presentation on how this all works if you are interested.
Items required for a Reverse Mtg are Value, Payoff, Zip Code and DOB (all applicants)
There are no income or credit score restrictions, just age and value are considered when qualifying
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1stintegritymort
1280 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 4:00:29 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
Look heres the deal.. both of my borrowers im trying to do loans for are in negitive am programs that are getting ready to RECAST. what im trying to do is buy them 5-10 yrs by cashing them out enough money to be able to survive in the lowest i/o payment fixed for 5-10 yrs. oterwise when the loan recasts they screwed! they will not be able to make the payment.
so i am open to all suggestions!!
if you are open to any suggestions, then i would say they should sell their home. take the 260k in equity and buy a house in cash. ofcourse you would lose the deal, but if you want whats best for the borrower, that is the way to do it. since they are not eligible for a reverse mortgage, that in my opinion is their best option. |
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Cliff_Auerswald
363 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 4:15:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Have you talked to them about going reverse mortgage?
Is it a cash-out or rate / term?
1 of my scenarios is of the age of 52 and is on disabilty.... the other the reverse mortgage company that i usually use is saying they hve to come in with 90k to do a reverse... they owe 340k and the home is worth 600k..
my apologies I didn't see the ages here, on scenario #2 it's worth a shot, and if they are still short the modernization bill is coming (limits to 550k) |
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AndrewSoss
353 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 4:19:00 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by AndrewSoss
quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by csmgcorp
Why are you taking it stated?
Dti is too high to go full doc....
then how are they going to pay the loan?
if they have significant assets, try an asset depletion loan through Wells.
any info on this would be great! never heard of it.
If they have significant assets, Wells can use them as income. Take the assets and amortize them over 15 years (on a 30 year loan) with a 1 yr libor as the rate of return...currently 1.88%.
So, if they have $500k in assets, they would get $3,189.99 to use as income. They can use it in addition to their fixed income, but not other income such as interest, dividents...etc.
----------------------------------------------
here's a copy of the guidelines:
D. Asset Dissipation Guidelines
Definition
Asset Dissipation is defined as an income stream resulting from the assumed liquidation of specified assets to meet the living expenses of the Borrower.
There are two programs:
• Asset Dissipation I is for borrower’s who are 55 years of age or older
• Asset Dissipation II is for borrower’s that are younger than 55 years of age.
Restrictions
• Asset Dissipation I and II cannot be used in conjunction with other earned income for
qualification, with the exception of social security, pension and rental income.
• Interest, dividends and stock options cannot be included in qualifying income or verified
assets.
• If the borrower has additional sources of income from partnerships, and/or self-employment,
one year of appropriate tax returns are required. The sources of income must be analyzed to
determine the impact on cash flow and asset position. Losses must be deducted from assets
before calculating qualifying income.
Underwriting
Asset Dissipation I
The Borrower is typically retired. The following must be met:
• Borrower(s) is 55 years of age or older at the date of application and possess an
overabundance of accessible, historic liquidity (e.g., 500% pre-liquidity).
• Dissipation period must be the greater of 10 years or 50% of the loan’s amortization.
• 100% of the dissipated asset must be verified.
• Rate of return on liquidity will be the 1 year T-Bill constant maturity weekly average listed
as the “1-year Treasury” under “ARM Indices & Floors” in the Conforming Conventional
section of the rate sheets.
• Permanent D/I must not exceed 3% above the standard for Fixed Rate/ARMs.
• Standard post closing liquidity parameters apply.
• The dissipated asset must be comprised of readily marketable assets including, but not
limited to:
o Publicly traded stocks and bonds (stock options are not allowed)
o mutual funds,
o bank deposits,
o and fully vested retirement accounts/annuities.
• Retirement assets should be valued at 100% of the vested amount when the Borrower(s) is
59˝ (or more) years old. If the Borrower is less than 59˝ years old retirement assets should
be valued at 70% of the vested amount.
• Restricted stocks that are subject to Rule 144 will be permitted on a case-by-case basis
subject to Regional Credit Office (RCO) review of the SEC Registration Statement and any
lock-up agreements.
SUPER JUMBO PARAMETERS
Wells Fargo Wholesale Lending – Super Jumbo Parameters
August 2005
SECTION SUPER JUMBOPage
7
Asset Dissipation II
Borrower is generally not retired. The following must be met:
• Borrower(s) is younger than 55 years of age at the date of application, and has and
abundance of accessible and historic liquidity (e.g., 500% pre-closing liquidity).
• Dissipation period is equal to the term of the loan (e.g., for a 30 year fixed loan the
dissipation period would be 30 years).
• 100% of the dissipated assets must be verified.
• Rate of return on liquidity will be the 1 year T-Bill constant maturity weekly average listed
as the “1-year Treasury” under “ARM Indices & Floors” in the Conforming Conventional
section of the rate sheets.
• Permanent DI should not exceed 3% above the standard for Fixed Rate/ARMS.
• Standard post closing liquidity parameters apply.
Income Calculation
Asset(s) calculated for dissipation are utilized as the Present Value for reverse annuity payments.
Example
Given:
1. Borrower(s) have applied for 5/1 ARM, 30 year amortization.
2. $3.6MM post-closing liquidity, of which $800M will be used towards asset dissipation.
3. 1 year T-Bill weekly avg listed on rate sheets = 2.140%
Calculation:
1. $800,000 @ 2.140%
2. 15 year amortization = $5199.80 qualifying income
----------------------------------------------------------
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 5:29:46 PM
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| Cool thanks!!! |
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mojojojo_1
576 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 5:41:09 PM
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| funny how it seemed people started to get at you dcreed. see that all the time, seems people forget that 2 yrs ago stated retired was for just about any age or fico |
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slants
3803 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 5:49:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
Cool thanks!!!
Do your borrowers have substantial assets to be used to qualify as asset depletion? |
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Mtown
84 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 5:56:38 PM
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Try NBGI. Not sure what state it is but...
National Bankers Group Inc.
3330 Cahuenga Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA 90068
Office: (877) 818-NBGI
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 5:58:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by slants
quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
Cool thanks!!!
Do your borrowers have substantial assets to be used to qualify as asset depletion?
If im reading the guidelines correctly, it looks like they DO NOT have enough assets to qualify for asset depletion program..
back to square 1!!!
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epalafox
49 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 6:25:18 PM
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| JMAC does stated retired full doc 65% DTi..... |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 6:27:47 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by epalafox
JMAC does stated retired full doc 65% DTi.....
what does that mean??? " stated retired full doc " |
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Mtown
84 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 6:34:20 PM
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It's a nice and high DTI but you'd still have to show income documentation. Probably was a typo.
what state is it? try NBGI, i put their info on here earlier
for states: CA, WA, NV, CO, AK, HI, NJ, NY, VA, GA |
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epalafox
49 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 7:08:11 PM
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| No...FULL DOC Retired only that its 65% DTI which makes it easier... |
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EquitySmart
635 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 8:02:24 PM
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Please read this topic to learn why stated retired loans are NEVER a good idea:
http://www.brokeroutpost.com/loans/brokers/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=216690
Please either decline the loan or reduce LTV until you can get AUS approval. |
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Cliff_Auerswald
363 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 8:37:46 PM
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| We have few seniors that fell short to qualify for the reverse mortgage this month, they are all in wachovia world option arms. They will most likely be losing their homes, very sad and many waited to long to get out of them. Short term sell, lifetime mistake |
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mykal5
673 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 9:07:36 PM
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Instruct them to sell, and follow up in a month. They will have refinanced for sure, but you will have assumed no risk.
What is the DTI and can you gross up the income? |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 9:43:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by EquitySmart
Please read this topic to learn why stated retired loans are NEVER a good idea:
http://www.brokeroutpost.com/loans/brokers/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=216690
Please either decline the loan or reduce LTV until you can get AUS approval.
ok, i read the thread.. some really good points were made and i fully agree to a certain extent.. oh yeah and AlliedFinancial is an idiot!!!however, what am i suppose to do? im working with people on permanent disability, not of the age for a reverse mortgage and a retired people who do not have enough equity for a reverse mortgage, whos negam loans are going to recast because people in this industry kept telling these people to cash out cash out and put them into a negam and never explain the dramatic effect of these programs, now they are facing recast and will not be able to afford the payments of their loans and most definitely will be facing foreclosure shortly.. unless what.. somebody helps them. its sad these are people who have lived in their homes for 20-30-40+ years...
so these retirees in negams... such as the ones im working with are all going to be losing their homes once it recasts because they cant afford their new payment, don't qualify for a reverse mortgage, dont qualify to go full doc, dont qualify for asset depletion. thats sad!! so trying to pull out enough cash out to make up the difference between their negam payment and their new interest only payment for the next 10 years seems like a good idea to me. because i do need to over state their income so they can qualify to save their homes... your saying is fraud... i dont know what else to do for these people??? at least im not turning my back on elderly people who have been taken advantage of in the past by loan sharks who only cared about their own pockets... and just sitting back watching them lose their homes.
i am still open to any suggestions.
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slants
3803 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 9:52:51 PM
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| Help them negotiate a loan modification through their current lenders? They should be able to make a good case given the circumstances. You may not get a commission though. |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 9:59:47 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by slants
Help them negotiate a loan modification through their current lenders? They should be able to make a good case given the circumstances. You may not get a commission though.
that is a great idea! and thank you for the positive feedback. so many people i feel bash you on this web site for trying to help some else because you said the word STATED. i will look into that. |
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slants
3803 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 10:06:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by slants
Help them negotiate a loan modification through their current lenders? They should be able to make a good case given the circumstances. You may not get a commission though.
that is a great idea! and thank you for the positive feedback. so many people i feel bash you on this web site for trying to help some else because you said the word STATED. i will look into that.
You should be able to bill a fee into the closing for your service, but many LO's have reported that the lenders can end up bypassing you and dealing directly with the borrowers. Even so, you'll build good karma and hopefully many referrals. |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2008 : 10:49:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mtown
Try NBGI. Not sure what state it is but...
National Bankers Group Inc.
3330 Cahuenga Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA 90068
Office: (877) 818-NBGI
thank you, ill check it out tomorrow. |
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tropixman
67 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2008 : 06:04:46 AM
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| The Harris Bank owned by the Bank of Montreal(BMO)offered a stated retired product. |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2008 : 12:10:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
quote:
Originally posted by Mtown
Try NBGI. Not sure what state it is but...
National Bankers Group Inc.
3330 Cahuenga Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA 90068
Office: (877) 818-NBGI
thank you, ill check it out tomorrow.
negetive on NBGI... full doc only..
any others????????? |
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dcreed
75 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2008 : 1:27:23 PM
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bump...
need some help... cannot do reverse mortgages on these because of 362k limits...
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iclose
18 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2008 : 10:38:47 PM
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| Try Home Savings |
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StayInHomeGuy
240 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2008 : 08:36:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
bump...
need some help... cannot do reverse mortgages on these because of 362k limits...
If your borrowers can hold on until July the FHA modernization bill should pass that month, which will raise the lending limits nationwide to 550k, they will qualify at that time. Or, if they have the assests to make up for the difference, they can liquidate those and qualify right now. If you would like some specific numbers feel free to contact. Good luck! |
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Cliff_Auerswald
363 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2008 : 09:08:54 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by StayInHomeGuy
quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
bump...
need some help... cannot do reverse mortgages on these because of 362k limits...
If your borrowers can hold on until July the FHA modernization bill should pass that month, which will raise the lending limits nationwide to 550k, they will qualify at that time. Or, if they have the assests to make up for the difference, they can liquidate those and qualify right now. If you would like some specific numbers feel free to contact. Good luck!
There is no specific date on when the bill should get to the president, if it doesn't pass within the next 30 days I would think it will certainly be after Novermber elections |
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StayInHomeGuy
240 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2008 : 09:11:52 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Cliff_Auerswald
quote:
Originally posted by StayInHomeGuy
quote:
Originally posted by dcreed
bump...
need some help... cannot do reverse mortgages on these because of 362k limits...
If your borrowers can hold on until July the FHA modernization bill should pass that month, which will raise the lending limits nationwide to 550k, they will qualify at that time. Or, if they have the assests to make up for the difference, they can liquidate those and qualify right now. If you would like some specific numbers feel free to contact. Good luck!
There is no specific date on when the bill should get to the president, if it doesn't pass within the next 30 days I would think it will certainly be after Novermber elections
This is true, that why I said "should', then again we have been expecting this for a while and it keeps getting pushed back. I will keep my fingers crossed for July, as I'm sure you will too :) |
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Cliff_Auerswald
363 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2008 : 09:18:44 AM
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I have been dreaming of the thing for a year now, one thing that scares me is that NRMLA says the whole thing can end up getting vetoed...
"It is the hope of the House leadership to get the Senate to act soon and complete this process in time to get a bill to the President by the July 4th recess. The President, in the meantime, has threatened to veto the whole bill because he is opposed to the foreclosure relief provisions.The Senate version contains the earlier provision limiting HECM origination fees to 1.5% of maximum claim amount. It also has an amendment by Sen. Claire McCaskill placing restrictions on the sale of other financial products with HECMs that is more restrictive than the House language." |
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StayInHomeGuy
240 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2008 : 09:26:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Cliff_Auerswald
I have been dreaming of the thing for a year now, one thing that scares me is that NRMLA says the whole thing can end up getting vetoed...
"It is the hope of the House leadership to get the Senate to act soon and complete this process in time to get a bill to the President by the July 4th recess. The President, in the meantime, has threatened to veto the whole bill because he is opposed to the foreclosure relief provisions.The Senate version contains the earlier provision limiting HECM origination fees to 1.5% of maximum claim amount. It also has an amendment by Sen. Claire McCaskill placing restrictions on the sale of other financial products with HECMs that is more restrictive than the House language."
This is my fear as well, the house can override the veto with a 2/3rds vote, but the vote they just had that passed it did not meet that requirement. One more reason to dislike Bush if he moves on this bill...... |
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